Why is the C# team allowing this to Happen? and Why do they close threads on the topic?

Why is the C# team allowing this to Happen? and Why do they close threads on the topic?

• jbourne

  The article talks about why example code from MSDN and other sources within Microsoft is predominantly written in VB.NET. I doubt the C# team have any great say in that decision, Tad. The C# team don't own MSDN. -- Brendan Reynolds wrote in message news:6ecc55d6-c8ce-46b4-b6e9-bdb1ca119e9f@discussions.microsoft.com... Since PJ. van de Sande Closed the last thread I opened : Why is the C# team allowing this to happen I guess because he didn't click the link. I brought the link information here..... From Tom Archers blog Why so many examples in Visual Basic We find another thing for us to ignore from MS when trying to do what they do, and not what they say to do. This blog from Feb I wrote touches on the VB.NET & C# mess discussed in the threads from his Blog, plus some other things to ignore from MS. DNA, SOA, Software Architecture, VB.NET, CMMI, Agile Development - Doing what Microsoft does, not what they say to do. We will just need to keep turning to third party authors on how to use MS tools, like we always have. The Marketing Machine Marches on.
  

• JonL.

  Tad,

  Rather than pointing to a heap of links that may or may not be around when someone reads this post in a couple months or so, how about putting your argument forward on this thread and tell us what you think the C# team should do.

  PJ closed it last time because you didn't provide any input, you just posted a link.

  
  
  

• arunprakashr

  From what I understand it will be (or is) with the Vista environment releases. Not in the current releases. The current releases are equal or lean towards C#.

  Wait, so let me try to get this right - you are pissed off about something that you heard might happen in a future Windows release Isn't this a bit premature to do When Vista ships out, and you'll see that the two are treated unequally, then you could complain. Also, if there would be a disproportion between the two languages, why not help out and submit code for the "minority" language, rather than complain and ask the C# people to answer. If in Vista the examples will be more in C# than VB.NET, I'd complain to the VB people anyways ;)

  
  
  

• VladD2

  I have yet to find a case in the online documentation of MSDN where there isn't documentation for C#. Typically it goes like this:

  VB.Net

  C#

  (maybe C++)

  (rarely ever in a blue moon J#)

  I think a better question for the C# team is why does VB.Net have the "My" space and C# doesn't and is it every coming to C#

  
  
  

• Sr Rob

  I totally agree that i don't like to waste my time into translating code. But normally as developer you don't need sample code, only some good documentation.
  
  Sample code is only for learning purpose, most profesional books don't have sample code only some pseudo code.
  
  But, a lot of beginning and home developers write in VB.NET and that are the programmers that need the sample code the most. No offence, but when i dropped this discussion at lunch here at the office most developers started to laugh!
  Who cares sample code
  
  I do care sometimes, sometimes a few lines of code can replace a whole documentation. But if this source code is Java, VB.NET or C#, i don't care.
  
  My opiniun is that i never missed C# sample code and that the most technical and profecional articles are written in C# as far as my experience go. I agree with you when you are reading a article about some multi-threading i prefer C# sample code. Most of the topics are covert in VB.NET and C# as well, so again i don't see any problems.
  
  
  

• Jim Wang

   

  Cosmin Nicolaescu wrote:

  Wait, so let me try to get this right - you are pissed off about something that you heard might happen in a future Windows release Isn't this a bit premature to do When Vista ships out, and you'll see that the two are treated unequally, then you could complain. Also, if there would be a disproportion between the two languages, why not help out and submit code for the "minority" language, rather than complain and ask the C# people to answer. If in Vista the examples will be more in C# than VB.NET, I'd complain to the VB people anyways ;)

  Tom Archer is a pretty good source for information.  If he says it is happening, I trust that it is.  And yes I am saying I am pissed before it happens in hopes of having some impact that may change it.  If Tom says it is happening, it is.  Will it change ... maybe.  But until I hear it has, yep I am ticked off.

  Why don't I spend all day writing code samples for MS   I am not sure what type of job you have, but because I already have a job to do providing my customer with the documentation to support the application I am building them, and I am providing them with code samples for their developers to read when using our core framework to build applications, I don't have time to do Microsoft's job too.

  I expect that if I told my customer I wasn't going to provide them any documentation, and that instead of complaining to me about it they should write it themselves....  I would have time to do Microsoft's job for them because I'd be kicked out the door.

  
  

• ReyCri

  Tad,

  do you have any examples where there is no C# but VB.NET code I myself have used a few samples provided on MSDN and there has always been C# and VB.NET sources downloadable. So what I have seen so far, the support for C# and VB.NET has been equal. I think it would be more fair to ask why the managed C++ samples are less than for C#/VB.NET.

  I also read Tom Archers blog and I see no examples of where this is happening.

  Why users do not find C# articles and samples does not really come down to the C# team. I started with VB3 with a touch of VB for DOS more than 10 years ago. I only started with C# some years back.

  It would not surprise me if there are more people that can, want and do write VB.NET articles/samples than C#. From Microsoft I have only seen equal support, so to repeat my question to you. Where is a VB.NET sample without a C# sample

  
  
  

• asheridan

  Cosmin Nicolaescu wrote:

  If in Vista the examples will be more in C# than VB.NET, I'd complain to the VB people anyways ;)

  Sorry I take that back, got languages confused :)

  Still, I wouldn't complain to/about the C# team, but to the MSDN people, or perhaps Vista team...then again, I already said that contributing rather than complaining yield better results.

  
  
  

• Pejacepoha

  Keith Elder wrote:

  I have yet to find a case in the online documentation of MSDN where there isn't documentation for C#. Typically it goes like this: VB.Net C# (maybe C++) (rarely ever in a blue moon J#)

  From what I understand it will be (or is) with the Vista environment releases. Not in the current releases. The current releases are equal or lean towards C#.

  =======================================================

  Keith Elder wrote:

  I think a better question for the C# team is why does VB.Net have the "My" space and C# doesn't and is it every coming to C#

  Juval Lowy wrote a "That" equivalent here:

  http://www.idesign.net/idesign/DesktopDefault.aspx tabindex=-1&tabid=19&download=141

  
  

• Nitin Gupta

  Tad,

  I read Tom Archers blog entry and it actually explains why there are more VB.NET articles than C#/C++. The link you added answers your question. It is a business decision.

  C#/C++ developers are more likely to accept that code is written in another language and are usually able to use and translate it into their language of choice.

  This makes sense for me as I use all microsoft .NET languages. I do not really mind what exact language a article is written for as long as it is interesting.

  
  
  

• LouisDePage

  Andreas Johansson wrote:

  From Microsoft I have only seen equal support, so to repeat my question to you. Where is a VB.NET sample without a C# sample

  From what I understand it will be (or is) with the Vista environment releases.  Not in the current releases.  The current releases are equal or lean towards C#.

  
  

• ptaylor

  David M. Kean - MSFT wrote:

  Tad, Rather than pointing to a heap of links that may or may not be around when someone reads this post in a couple months or so, how about putting your argument forward on this thread and tell us what you think the C# team should do. PJ closed it last time because you didn't provide any input, you just posted a link.

  I am asking a question of others to provide input.

  Why would I answer my own question with my own input.  If I had the input to answer the question, I wouldn't need to post the question would I

  And... Don't use links   The initial sole purpose of the internet was to provide links.  Sorry, but links are a good thing...

   Please no more about how people don't want to click links, and how they want me to provide my own answers.  Please stick to the post's context.

   

  
  

• john.d

  NNTP User wrote:

  I doubt the C# team have any great say in that decision, Tad. The C# team don't own MSDN.

  No I am sure they do not own it, but they must have a voice in MS decisions.

  What I am looking for is feedback from the team as to why MS uses C++ and C# as their only internal development languages for their products, but provide primary service to VB.NET developers now.  They didn't before.

  I know the VB.NET programmers are your bread and butter, so that answer I am not looking for.  I am looking for the details on justifying not supporting both equally, and if you can't, then leaving the primary languages supported the most, being the ones MS uses.

  
  

• Craig Guyer

  Andreas Johansson wrote:

  Tad, I read Tom Archers blog entry and it actually explains why there are more VB.NET articles than C#/C++. The link you added answers your question. It is a business decision. C#/C++ developers are more likely to accept that code is written in another language and are usually able to use and translate it into their language of choice. This makes sense for me as I use all microsoft .NET languages. I do not really mind what exact language a article is written for as long as it is interesting.

  I hear more people say that, than I seeing them doing it. I have sent my developers VB.NET examples and they aren't interested in translating it. They will just complain about it being in VB.NET, ignore it, and write it on there own. If you are on a long engagement of C# and C++, it is just as annoying to the C# developer to read VB.NET as it is for the VB.NET developer to read C#. I'll read JAVA pattern books before I read VB.NET pattern books.

  Personally I won't by a book, watch a seminar, or read a VB.NET article unless I am stuck for some reason and desperate, or I end up on a project that can not be changed to C#. The syntax just gets under my skin. I don't want to waste the mind power into translating it.

  I have gone onto a lot of VB.NET projects. But I always get them changed over to C#. VB 6.0 developers allowed to code in VB.NET is just a dangerous combination. There has only been one I could not get changed, and that was because the state said it had to be done in VB.NET.

  I believe the C# developer is more capable of translating the code from VB.NET, but I don't believe they are anymore likely to if they don't have to.

  
  
• Why is the C# team allowing this to Happen? and Why do they close threads on the topic?